Widely known as Nori in THE HOBBIT and as Dagda Mor in THE SHANNARA CHRONICLES, Jed Brophy is considered one of the best actors in the business. While promoting his movie INTO THE STORM, actor Richard Armitage was asked which members of The Hobbit cast would he choose to be in a survival team if there was a natural disaster? One of the three he mentioned was Jed Brophy. A New Zealander highly respected for his acting range, Brophy’s extensive work in includes roles in The Lord of the Rings trilogies (he was a Nazgul), King Kong, District 9 and Heavenly Creatures. His advocacy for the environment and gender equality is well-known.
Lucy: How is gender equality viewed in New Zealand? Because Iceland is about 20+ years ahead of everyone.
JBrophy: We are lucky in [New Zealand] that we have so many women in positions of power. They are role models for young women. We had two women prime ministers - Helen Clark and Jenny Shipley, Attorney-Generals Dame Silvia Cartwright and Dame Margaret Wilson (Dame Sylvia later went on to become Governor General). We have many women in the medical system and at one point in our political history all of the top jobs in State government were held by women. The Prime Minister, the Chief Justice, the leader of the Opposition Party, all women.
Lucy: That’s very impressive considering many countries are struggling to elect one woman into high political office. What is it like in the film industry?
JBrophy: People in my industry have been at the forefront of changing gender inequality. Women are not giving up.
Lucy: In The Hobbit film feature extras I noticed the scale doubles of the dwarves were women.
JBrophy: My scale double was 18 years old. I met her entire family. They all came to the very first wrap party we had. We really came to the conclusion that [the dwarves] had to be women because of the fact they were petite enough to be a scale double for us. Also they had an iron resolve. I don’t say this to belittle the men but the women complained a lot less and they got on with the job. It was a job they were fairly well paid for and an opportunity to be in the film industry, to see it close and to make a decision where they want to be in the industry. They were looked after really well but the women had a stronger work ethics.
Lucy: In regards to gender equality, is WETA WORKSHOP at the forefront in the film industry in Wellington?
JBrophy: Richard [Taylor] and Tania [Rodger] who run WETA have taken people on their skill set and not on their gender. [There are more] women working as camera people who have skilled themselves in jobs for Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit now running their own camera crews.
Lucy: Is there a particular segment in your film industry where you see more growth for women?
JBrophy: For writing and getting funding for film there is still a gap but it’s slowly closing. A friend of mine [filmmaker] Miranda Harcourt and her husband just got funding to make a film. Her daughter and son are getting a lot of work. There is a second generation like my son and his friends like Bea Joblin that has already made a television series, a feature film on her own and she’s raising money to get another feature film off the ground.
Lucy: Can you tell me more about New Zealand’s indigenous culture and filmmaking?
JBrophy: They have a separate Unit of the Arts funding which ensures The Maori and Pacific population get an opportunity to tell their stories. We should be proud as a Nation, that through this funding a lot of great filmmakers are getting traction to tell unique stories. The Maori came here as explorers. A lot of people came to New Zealand to start again from parts of Europe and British Isles. We were made up of a group of nationalities who were escaping persecution, job loss or starvation or just wanted to change their lot in life in some way. We have a very proud history of standing up and doing things our way.
Lucy: Does culture and history play a part in the gender equality gap?
JBrophy: The gender equality gap is starting to close for that reason because we’re aware of the fact of a lot of strong minded and very gifted young women coming through this next generation who won’t be stopped for any reason. We’re a small enough nation to embrace that.
“We’re very lucky that the indigenous culture has remarkably kept its own form of identity. Their stories are very important to us as a nation. ”
Lucy: New Zealand women filmmakers have such a distinct voice in the industry, aren't they?
JBrophy: In the arts especially in this country it’s much more about what your talent base is and what your passion is more than an extra Y chromosome. We are isolated anyway, the same thing with Iceland. We don’t have to buy into what the rest of the world is doing. Australia has become a settlement of America whereas largely we just want to be New Zealanders.
Lucy: When you stay away from certain influences, like the current political situation in Hollywood, that’s not a bad thing.
JBrophy: Jane Campion has made films in Hollywood, she prefers to come back here and make the stories which have a distinct New Zealand flavor. There’s something about the power of this country - to find the kind of films they want to make without people stopping them. It’s true there is a certain amount of success and it opens doors that’s for sure. I look at my son and his friends from his drama class in Wellington High and all the young women are the ones making the charge.
Lucy: That's quite progressive. So many women had key crew jobs in the LOTR and The Hobbit Trilogies.
JBrophy: Absolutely! In The Hobbit trilogy, Tami Lane’s crew (prosthetic makeup department) and most of the costume department were women. They were working 16-hour days every day for 2 ½ years. Ngilla Dixon, who was head of the costume department on Lord of the Rings, who has since gone on to do a lot of other films, she ran that group of people not with an iron fist but with huge skill set. In terms of aesthetics of the films – it was the meeting of great minds [Ngilla, Philippa, Fran].
Peter understood that aesthetically they were all over that. Pete can be left alone to just film the film knowing that Philippa and Fran were scripting behind him and making sure the aesthetics of the film have that kind of competency and consistency.
Lucy: What would it be like for, let’s say for example, someone from Texas who is 18 years old and is brilliant and wants to work at WETA?
JBrophy: Richard and Tania will read any portfolio that comes across. The advice I’ll give them is to make sure they show all the work because they both want to see that you can come up with the original idea and follow it through to the production point. But it doesn’t matter if you’re male or female. Tania is the person who does all the employing. Without Tania there would be no WETA. Richard [Taylor] says that all the time. He says “don’t ask me, ask Tania, she runs the place.”
Lucy: I always got that impression.
JBrophy: The same with Peter and Fran. Peter always acknowledges that without her, he wouldn’t be able to do what he does and vice versa. The arts in New Zealand has thrived now that we’ve got people like Philippa, Fran and Tanya who are in charge of such big production houses.
Lucy: I can imagine the epic logistics of running the production every day.
JBrophy: It’s like an army mobilizing to go to war! Talking about the production office -- the people there were passionate about their work, they wanted to make the movies happen. We all knew we were part of something greater than just making another film.
Lucy: From your point of view as an actor in these films, what is the Philippa and Fran screenwriting dynamic?
JBrophy: A lot of the script amendments were things they came up with. At least that’s how it appears to work. It is a complex thing writing with three people but Philippa and Fran were there a lot of the time, they had tremendous input. For whatever reason, Tolkien didn’t have a lot of female characters in the story but it was important to Philippa and Fran that they have a better [gender] balance.
Lucy: I would have liked to see more of Philippa and Fran in the special features.
JBrophy: People talk about Peter Jackson all the time and not often about Philippa and Fran but they just prefer NOT to be in the limelight so they can focus on their work and not be distracted.
Lucy: People connected with Tauriel's character and casting Evangeline Lilly for the role was a brilliant choice.
JBrophy: [Tauriel] is one of the strongest characters in the story because we see her ability to fall in love and separate herself from the diatribe that the elves are emotionless people. [This invites] a bit of a conversation, I think, about how humans have become desensitized. [Fran and Philippa] very wisely used [Tauriel] as a channel so people can agree that “Yes, love is important.”
Lucy: Do you see gender equality losing its momentum any time soon?
JBrophy: I don’t think so. There are a lot of men who might have been resistant to it but if you’re a parent of a young woman you want them to do well. I think any kind of radical movement alienates a certain amount of people but you need that radical element to get the message across.
The internet has helped, it’s accessible to get it out to people, the biggest problem is the same here getting to the people in charge of releasing the films or allowing young people to have those opportunities. My wife Yolande is a strong person and she’s never had any doubt as to what she wants to do. She teaches people how to farm organically and teaches MAHIKARI which is a form of spiritual healing.
Lucy: That's wonderful! I think we're all connected to the Earth and any damage to it we’re also damaging ourselves.
JBrophy: Yes! She and her group are leaders in their own right, nurturers who are not just trying to heal people but they are trying to heal the earth. My boys never had this kind of idea there is a difference between what men and women can or cannot do.
Lucy: In the USA we have a has a serious gender inequality problem and high rates of domestic abuse (both men and women).
JBrophy: My eldest son has been very vocal about gender equality. He believes that feminism isn’t a woman’s issue but both sides in the discussion. One of the things that is lovely about our [New Zealand] society is that we love sport. Both my boys did Surf Lifesaving where young men and women competed and trained with each other. Fiercely competitive! Young men and women getting thrown into competition together. I think it’s a healthy thing and it creates an understanding that there is no difference between us except that extra chromosome.
SHANNARA CHRONICLES
Lucy: What drew you to the role of Dagda Mor in The Shannara Chronicles?
JBrophy: To be honest I had not read the books until I was cast but I am a huge fan of the genre and I’ve read a lot of work by folks who love his [Brooks’] realm. I tried not to read too much into his description of the Dagda as I wanted to be able to make him my Dagda.
Lucy: Did your extensive experience working with the Tolkien trilogies help with the challenges of this role?
JBrophy: Yes, it helped a lot but it is always difficult as an actor to find the balance between what has already been written about your character and being able to make that character real for yourself. So for me the Dagda Mor is driven by two major imperatives: Revenge and Destiny.
Lucy: Compared to Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit Movies, is the Dagda Mor character the most challenging in terms of the costume and prosthetics?
JBrophy: Yes, Dagda Mor is one of the more challenging characters I have had to play. Vinnie [Ashton], our head of the makeup department, had a huge job on this production. My makeup team were just amazing. There were aspects of the prosthetic that were akin to playing an Orc! The dentures were similar and the look. It was the most extensive in terms of pieces used to put the face on. I had the luck of having the design done by one of the geniuses at WETA and then applied and made up by the wonderful Shay Lawrence and his team.
Lucy: What time did you start the make-up process?
JBrophy: We started at roughly 2am and sometimes earlier. I would get into costume by breakfast then be in costume and makeup for the next 12 hours. Very long periods of time. The wardrobe and makeup folk do their upmost to keep me comfortable, but there is a fair amount of discomfort.
Lucy: Your Dagda Mor suit and makeup are so real you forget it’s you under all of that. I’m looking at the contact lenses, the teeth, the lip makeup and all etc.
JBrophy: I had a Lens technician who made sure I had the lenses out every 4 hours. All this would have been arduous except that I had been through all of this before on the LOTR trilogy and then again on The Hobbit. It really does help to know what to expect. It’s no easy thing being encased to create a “Creature” character but it can be very satisfying to be a part of a Team all trying to make that Monster or Character as real or unreal as possible. The trick is being able to forget about the distractions of the technical aspects and concentrate on telling the story.
Lucy: Prosthetics are flawless, you can see the incredible detail around the brows and eyelids.
JBrophy: I have an excellent team of people all pushing hard to get the Dagda to set and then keeping me ready and alive. But yes one of the more challenging characters I have played. On top of all that, Manu Bennet and I had to learn a new language and that was very tricky indeed!
Lucy: I’m happy to see Jane Holland design your whole look!
JBrophy: I loved [the Dagda Mor] costume! There were bits that were a wee bit difficult such as the armor shoulder guards. I didn’t have quite as much rotation on the vertical axis as I would have liked but I soon learned to compensate. Jane [Holland] got me to move around and see what I could or couldn’t do while in the later design stages. She got her team to come up with ways to lighten the costume but still retain the armored look.
Lucy: Yes the details are incredible with all these carved symbols.
JBrophy: The cloak was able to be detached, and at times it got quite tiring to wear but that is the Gig as we say in the Traps (the business). The long nails, I have to admit, I was not a fan of [them] initially but again they were part of a close-fitting glove that I was able to take off to have lunch etc. After a few days I was able to ignore them while playing the Character [Dagda Mor]. The directors would sometimes have to get me to hold the staff differently so the long nails did not obscure my face, but on the whole I loved what Jane Holland gave me to play in. I was jealous, though, of some of the very stylish costumes the actors got to work in.
Lucy: I never thought MTV would get Shannara Chronicles made.
JBrophy: It’s good for New Zealand having another big fantasy production like that. They got lucky too that most of the people working on visual and special effects had worked on The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings --
Lucy: That’s an embarrassment of riches –
JBrophy: Absolute embarrassment of riches!
Lucy: I’m impressed with the number of women in key management or acting roles in Shannara Chronicles.
JBrophy: I worked with a great crew of people in all departments, a goodly number of women experts. For example, April Blair is not only a co-executive producer but she wrote two of the Shannara Chronicles episodes. In the wardrobe Department I was very happy to find Jane Holland at the helm! To be honest, there are still a lot less women who are heads of departments or producers but more and more are joining the film industry.
Lucy: I hope that momentum continues!
JBrophy: I am ever the optimist.
Lucy: How involved is Terri Brooks in the script writing?
JBrophy: He has input to help flesh out the characters and he’s happy for them to digress if they want to create characters or cut them out. It’s difficult for an author that signs over the rights to his books. I talked to Mr. Martin about this too [Game of Thrones] and they’re smart to keep him as consultant.
Lucy : Would you guest star in Game of Thrones?
JBrophy: Definitely, if they asked me. The tricky thing is it’s the same in New Zealand, you give work first to people who live in that country [you’re filming]. For me, the blessing and the curse is that I work here all the time. For me to work in another country means uprooting and going there. I have a great life in Paradise. We live in the best country in the world.
Lucy: I’d gladly get on a plane to go there. Huh, maybe I’ll marry a Kiwi.
JBrophy: Sure! Come on over! Lucy, you gotta put it out there in the Universe and see what happens.
(both laughing)
Lucy: Let me think about that. Maybe I will!
About Social Media
Lucy: You are great with people on social media. I asked you on Twitter if I can interview you and you said yes without hesitation. Thank you for being so open.
JBrophy: Thank my mom! She said to be open to the possibilities. When she was bringing us up she was the strong person who didn’t listen to my dad. Regardless, she still did the things that impassioned her. It wasn’t easy for her but she said to us to follow our dreams. You’ll regret it if you don’t. It’s not difficult to answer people on Twitter but I just won’t put up with rudeness or folks expecting me to be available when THEY want me to be simply because of the job I do.
Lucy: I’ve seen the way they talk to you sometimes on Twitter. It’s not nice at all but I think it’s because they just want your attention. They'll do anything to shock you but that's to their detriment.
JBrophy: Being a fan doesn't give you the right to demand attention. I do my best to answer fans questions but not about anything to do with my private life. Only about my work life. What is easier here in New Zealand is there is no such thing as being a celebrity. Acting is just a job. It seems being important but not more important than anything else. That’s why I have no real interest in being part of the Hollywood industry because you have to play those games and it doesn’t sit comfortable with me. One of the things about LOTR and The Hobbit is that Peter, Fran and Phillipa cast very good people who just happened to be good actors.
Lucy: That’s the truth!
JBrophy: We’re privileged to be able to make money doing something we love. For me to turn around and deny my fans access given that I wouldn’t have a career without them seems a bit small-minded.
Lucy: That is amazing for you to say that. Many actors don’t see it that way. They’re arrogant as if the world owes them everything.
JBrophy: It’s a shame. I do travel to a lot of conventions and I am warmed by the fact that fans want to talk to me.
Lucy: That's because you’re very kind to your fans.
JBrophy: If a little bit of positivity and giving them a bit of our time inspires them to do something great (become a filmmaker for example) then maybe we’re passing on something rather than taking it all for ourselves. I don’t like selfishness. I really have NO time for that.
Lucy: I don’t think your wife would be married to you if you were.
JBrophy: She allowed me to do the job and kept the home fires burning when I was out there earning a living. Without her, we wouldn’t have any of this.
Jed smiles and looks around his home with great pride.
Jed Brophy's latest film project is the groundbreaking #BlueMoon. Go here for more information about the film. Follow Jed Brophy on his social media accounts (be nice):
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jedibrophy
Twitter: https://twitter.com/BrophyJed?s=17
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